Are we in the golden age of music?

[Flint]

I too have fond memories of digging through the bins of LPs at several great local record stores. But when I really think back to what I was doing and how I felt, I was frustrated most of the time. I looked at the same unsold LPs a billion times, desperate to find something new or interesting. On Wednesday's the new shipments arrived and were put out, and I learned that if I went straight from school to the store I could see all the latest releases or replenishments. My memories of joy were more about finding something great, which only happened about one in ten visits, which seems impossibly annoying compared to how I shop today where every time I choose to shop I find dozens of albums I want to own.

Basically, they are fond memories because I spent so much time in those stores and it defined much of my youth. The joy of finding a good album was exaggerated because it was a pretty rare experience. Anything tastes amazing when you haven't eaten in a week, right?

I don't see that as a "golden age". I was fed what the record labels fed me, and it was VERY limited compared to even the 1990s when self-publishing got started at scale. Today I can get anything and everything without borders (remember how exciting it was to get a good import?). There are so many amazing albums out there today, it is limitless. However, there is also an equivalent increase in shitty music. So hunting without aid is likely to result in much failure. But today we have customer resource management platforms which build profiles of your shopping habits and ratings and provide very reliable recommendations.

So, that is why I consider this the golden age of popular music recordings. It isn't the golden age of jazz, nor the golden age of classical, nor the golden age of extravaganza (like the epics from Tchaikovsky or Wagner), but it is the golden age of studio recordings by pop/rock/blues/R&B/etc. artists.

 

[Randy]

I too have fond memories of digging through the bins of LPs at several great local record stores. But when I really think back to what I was doing and how I felt, I was frustrated most of the time. I looked at the same unsold LPs a billion times, desperate to find something new or interesting. On Wednesday's the new shipments arrived and were put out, and I learned that if I went straight from school to the store I could see all the latest releases or replenishments. My memories of joy were more about finding something great, which only happened about one in ten visits, which seems impossibly annoying compared to how I shop today where every time I choose to shop I find dozens of albums I want to own.

Maybe you changed as a consumer. Back then was money tighter? Did you have to be more aware of what you purchased? Only purchasing those albums that you were totally excited about? Do you now have the financial wherewithal to make a mistake and it not have the same consequence as wasting $10 when you were in school? Have you become more of a collector now and just want to purchase more albums for whatever reason?

 

[Flint]

Maybe you changed as a consumer. Back then was money tighter? Did you have to be more aware of what you purchased? Only purchasing those albums that you were totally excited about? Do you now have the financial wherewithal to make a mistake and it not have the same consequence as wasting $10 when you were in school? Have you become more of a collector now and just want to purchase more albums for whatever reason?

I always had money for music and my drumming. I didn't get an allowance, so as soon as I was able I started mowing lawns and doing general yard cleanup for people and made a good living. So, it wasn't a money issue.

The issue was there was so much shit I hated in the record stores that any album I didn't know anything about I was nervous to buy. I often tried new records, but was more often disappointed than pleased, so I became gun-shy about buying unknown music. None of my record stores allowed customers to playing new LPs. They would let us play used LPs, but those were rare in those days. The used record stores weren't big in my town until the mid-80s. I also didn't have access to reliable reviews of what was coming out to learn from. I had word of mouth recommendations, FM radio for top 100 artists, the college radio station for stranger stuff (like I discovered REM after their first LP was released via the college radio station), and a few magazines like Audio and Stereo Review to get advice from. The best source for high quality albums was the Klipsch/B&O/Altec dealer in El Paso which always had tons of great demo material to listen to.

So, basically, the record store was really more frustrating than a joy, but the pull of finding music drew me in, much like the thrill of winning a lottery scratch off card draws people in.

 

[Randy]

I always had money for music and my drumming. I didn't get an allowance, so as soon as I was able I started mowing lawns and doing general yard cleanup for people and made a good living. So, it wasn't a money issue.

Same for me too and I kinda figured that but $10 today is still a little different than it was back then. for me anyway.

The issue was there was so much shit I hated in the record stores that any album I didn't know anything about I was nervous to buy. I often tried new records, but was more often disappointed than pleased, so I became gun-shy about buying unknown music. None of my record stores allowed customers to playing new LPs. They would let us play used LPs, but those were rare in those days. The used record stores weren't big in my town until the mid-80s. I also didn't have access to reliable reviews of what was coming out to learn from. I had word of mouth recommendations, FM radio for top 100 artists, the college radio station for stranger stuff (like I discovered REM after their first LP was released via the college radio station), and a few magazines like Audio and Stereo Review to get advice from. The best source for high quality albums was the Klipsch/B&O/Altec dealer in El Paso which always had tons of great demo material to listen to.

So that goes to my point, are you more willing to make a mistake now?

So, basically, the record store was really more frustrating than a joy, but the pull of finding music drew me in, much like the thrill of winning a lottery scratch off card draws people in.

I think that was the joy for all of us. Finding that gem that you listened to start to finish and loved every song.

 

[Flint]

Same for me too and I kinda figured that but $10 today is still a little different than it was back then. for me anyway.

I typically charged between $10 and $25 for a yard and mowed about 10 yards a week. Add to that one off leave raking, firewood cplitting and stacking, cleaning out side yards and barns, and I made pretty good coin - more than all of my friends.

So that goes to my point, are you more willing to make a mistake now?

I am not more willing to make a mistake now. In fact, I am less willing to make a mistake today because today I have access to auditioning most music before I buy it, tons of reviews and advice sites, better access to who was performing in or participating in the creation of new music, and extremely reliable recommendation engines at Amazon, YouTube, and other sites to guide me and introduce stuff I'd never know about otherwise. Today, there are so many albums I already know I want that I don't need to take many risks like I did when I was young. Trust me, I learned the hard way that when guessing in the late 1970s my success rate was less than 75% good.

I think that was the joy for all of us. Finding that gem that you listened to start to finish and loved every song.

I must say, I am able to find new artists and music today which makes life amazing - and I can find it quite easily. I love this era of music very much.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

Finding albums in proper record stores back then was never a problem for me at the time since I only listened to classical music, and very little of that is not worth listening to. The bigger driver of my selection was finding a performance by a conductor and orchestra I was interested in, usually from reviews in magazines. A "song" for me back then was just another word for Lieder. I never even heard any rock music until I was maybe in my 20s. A Beatle was somebody misspelling beetle.

 

[Flint]

Finding albums in proper record stores back then was never a problem for me at the time since I only listened to classical music, and very little of that is not worth listening to. The bigger driver of my selection was finding a performance by a conductor and orchestra I was interested in, usually from reviews in magazines. A "song" for me back then was just another word for Lieder. I never even heard any rock music until I was maybe in my 20s. A Beatle was somebody misspelling beetle.

What do you think of the current state of recorded classical music?

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

What do you think of the current state of recorded classical music?

Like all recorded music, its going down the toilet. Orchestras are mostly no longer under contract to major record labels and any recordings they make are self-released. These recordings are mostly of live performances since its too expensive to convene a whole orchestra just for the purpose of making a recording. The action in Europe is a bit better, but not by much. All the major record companies have long since laid off their in-house production teams.

Music composition wise, I think classical music is suffering from the same thing that popular music is having to deal with; all the good notes have already been taken. While there's undoubtedly some good music being written these days, it is to my ears largely derivative of all that has come before. The last truly inventive period in classical music as far as I'm concerned was the "Avant Garde" period where music by composers like Ligeti (some of the music used in 2001: A Space Odyssey), Stockhausen, and other modernists were cranking out new compositions by the week. Later Arvo Paart, Penderecki, Gorecki and others wrote (and are writing) good stuff.

It costs a lot of money to record classical music, and the buying audience is really, really small.

Fortunately there is a huge catalog of legacy recordings going back decades which are, for the time being, still available on CD...as long as that lasts.

 

[Flint]

Thanks, that's insightful...

Rolling forward... have you heard any of the orchestral works by Stewart Copeland? Being a percussionist and drummer, I am fond of his work (very rhythmic with middle Eastern modes). He has been commissioned several times in recent decades and recently premiered his latest, The Invention of Morel, in Chicago. It definitely has pops influences, his being a rock drummer in experience. Just curious.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

Thanks, that's insightful...

Rolling forward... have you heard any of the orchestral works by Stewart Copeland? Being a percussionist and drummer, I am fond of his work (very rhythmic with middle Eastern modes). He has been commissioned several times in recent decades and recently premiered his latest, The Invention of Morel, in Chicago. It definitely has pops influences, his being a rock drummer in experience. Just curious.

Nope, haven't heard any of his orchestral music. I find a lot of the music by former movie music composers or rock musicians to be like trying to force what they have done in the past onto another ensemble, for no apparent reason (i.e. "serious" music which sounds like a rehashed movie soundtrack). Just because something can be written, doesn't mean its a great idea to be written! The music by former soundtrack composer Corigliano is quite good though, and not derivative to my ears.

 

[Deleted member 133]

Finding albums in proper record stores back then was never a problem for me at the time since I only listened to classical music, and very little of that is not worth listening to. The bigger driver of my selection was finding a performance by a conductor and orchestra I was interested in, usually from reviews in magazines. A "song" for me back then was just another word for Lieder. I never even heard any rock music until I was maybe in my 20s. A Beatle was somebody misspelling beetle.

I would buy "hi-fi" mags as much for the music reviews as for the gear - mostly because, while there were a couple of nice hi-fi stores in my town in the '70s when I was just getting into it, there was very little ability to "audition" or hear music. Local radio was pathetic. The first decent FM station that we could get was a rock station. Nothing wrong with that but it still left me unexposed to classical, jazz, etc. (Live country / folk was plentiful in my home town.) I have numerous vinyl albums in my collection whose purchase can be traced back to a review that I read.

Regarding classical in particular, I still find myself very deficient knowledge-wise. I have my favourite composers (Dvorak for example), pieces (his Symphony No. 9, for example - one recording of which you put on during our mini-GTG a few years back), artists (Ann-Sophie Mutter and James Ehnes for example), conductor (Herbert von Karajan), and orchestra (Berliner Philharmoniker), and a broad love of many others, but, just as my examples show, only of the more obvious / popular choices.

I find that listening to CBC 2 (Canadian public radio broadcaster that carries a few hours of classical music most every day, and who's hosts provide great knowledge / background / insight to the listener) over the last couple of years is both helping to fill in the knowledge gaps, and showing me how great the knowledge chasm actually is!

Jeff

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

It used to drive my parents crazy when they were trying to watch TV because I'd be in my room blasting some Stockhausen electronic composition - or one of my favorites, Le Voyage by Pierre Henry, which just sounded like noise to them. My dad used to burst in the room and say "turn down that freak-o shit! Great family support, that.

 

[Deleted member 133]

Mine was the exact opposite. For as long as I remember Dad had a big stereo console in the living room: built in speakers, tuner, turntable. He also had a record cabinet and loved big band and pop (Sinatra etc.) music. He and Mom would push back the coffee table and cut a rug. When I asked for a "stereo" of my own he bought me one: a Sears receiver w/ 8-track, a separate ceramic cartridge turntable and speakers - with an extra set of satellite speakers that I set up in my tiny bedroom. They never complained about me listening to music, no matter what it was. (Oh, they commented on it, but only in a teasing way.) I still have 110 of Dad's albums - which is about 1/10th of what was once in his collection. Mom had invited a neighbour's older son in to "take whatever you want" after he died in 1993 and that was that. It's probably what happened to my card collections years before as well. Luckily my comic collection escaped a similar fate. As I've mentioned before, by mutual consent, when I was in high school Dad got rid of the console, and I the Sears, and we went in on a true stereo system which was then set up in the basement. I've still got the receiver and turntable. I have a pair of Bose 301IIIs that is reasonably close in performance to the original 301s, and have bought an Akai cassette deck that's the same as what we had. The latter needs a complete overhaul - which my local repair shop will do for $175. I intend to eventually set the whole thing up, listen to music on it for a day, and then pack it all away - just for the heck of it.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

Better overhaul that Akai sooner than later if you want to have it run - parts for things like that are not getting more plentiful!

 

[Deleted member 133]

Better overhaul that Akai sooner than later if you want to have it run - parts for things like that are not getting more plentiful!

Wise words indeed!