OK - Color Me So Confused

[elfstone]

Are Atmos speakers and Front Height Speakers the same thing??

Went to look at the Klipsch towers with atmos built in and the guy at the audio/video place (not Best Buy) said that it's the same only a different name.

My older Marantz has speaker connections for Front Height speakers.

:confusion-seeingstars:

 

[yromj]

I'm not going to wade into this very deep because I'm not completely up to date. However, the front height speakers/channels that most receivers from yesteryear supported were matrixed in by the receiver. In other words, the audio on the disc didn't contain sound for those speakers, so the receiver would create it from the sound in the other channels, ala DPL, etc.

Atmos on the other hand contains discrete information for those other channels. So, the receiver is simply sending that information to those speakers and doesn't have to matrix it.

Now here's where I'm a little blurry. I know that companies are offering speakers like what you saw but I believe that "real" atmos speakers should be placed well over head, such as in the ceiling. I haven't looked at the specs that closely, though.

John

 

[Towen7]

Kind-of

Atmos is a proprietary sound format that uses 5 or 7 speakers in the normal locations in addition to 2 or 4 overhead speakers. The overhead channels are discreet channels. There are several companies selling "Atmos built-in" speakers. Those are really two separate speakers in one enclosure. They usually look like a traditional front L/R speakers with an additional driver pointed upward. That upward facing driver is wired to the overhead channel and reflects sound off the ceiling. If it works like it's intended the reflected sound will sound as though it emanating from the ceiling.

Old receivers with "front height" channels are not Atmos and they can not decode the Atmos tracks on discs. The receiver would take a normal stereo or 5.1 channel mix and spread some of that sound to the height channel in an effort to make to room sound bigger than it is.

http://www.dolby.com/us/en/guide/dolby- ... index.html
http://www.dolby.com/us/en/guide/dolby- ... index.html

 

[Zing]

The overhead channels are discreet channels.

This is what makes the difference. They are in the mix solely for this purpose, as opposed to being matrixed.

 

[Deleted member 133]

The overhead channels are discreet channels.

This is what makes the difference. They are in the mix solely for this purpose, as opposed to being matrixed.

Just how "discreet" can anything be that sits above your head and directs sounds towards anyone who happened to be underneath them. I mean just up there blabbering away about who knows what.

They'd have to at least get a room of their own...

Jeff

Different "discrete"?

 

[Lone Stranger]

The overhead channels are discreet channels.

This is what makes the difference. They are in the mix solely for this purpose, as opposed to being matrixed.

Just how "discreet" can anything be that sits above your head and directs sounds towards anyone who happened to be underneath them. I mean just up there blabbering away about who knows what.

They'd have to at least get a room of their own...

Jeff

Different "discrete"?

I noticed that spelling too yesterday and thought it was strange.

 

[Zing]

I beat up Tom enough about 'loose' when it should be 'lose' so I gave him a pass here for the sake of benefitting the OP.

 

[Towen7]

Sorry gang.
I use my phone for 99% of my posts and on too many occasions I don't catch the typos.
But I trust that this group is smart enough to understand what I mean.

So ...


Suck it!

 

[Deleted member 133]

I use my phone for 99% of my posts

Have I ever mentioned how much I love my DORO flip phone?

 

[Yesfan70]

..............There are several companies selling "Atmos built-in" speakers. Those are really two separate speakers in one enclosure. They usually look like a traditional front L/R speakers with an additional driver pointed upward. That upward facing driver is wired to the overhead channel and reflects sound off the ceiling. If it works like it's intended the reflected sound will sound as though it emanating from the ceiling..............

With those speakers.....could one (or is it even suggested?) use some reflective material to better "aim" the sound from the atmos drivers toward the listener? I could see where the lamp/mirror trick used for finding the prime spot for absorption panels could also be used to find the sweet spot for redirecting the sound wave from atmos driver to the listening position.



On another note. I love the Atmos experience. The other night I was watching Deep Impact and it literally felt like the house was coming down on top of me when the asteroids were impacting the earth. Then it dawned on me that it wasn't my Atmos at all but my kids jumping up, down, and stomping around upstairs above me. God those little fuckers know how to pull one over on the old man. Ha! :?

 

[Towen7]

The more reflective the ceiling surface the better. I don't know however if those speakers allow you to adjust the angle of the "height" speakers on top.

 

[Yesfan70]

The more reflective the ceiling surface the better. I don't know however if those speakers allow you to adjust the angle of the "height" speakers on top.

I don't know a lot about Atmos, so I couldn't tell you if the drivers in a pair of built in Atmos speakers would be adjustable or not. I don't really plan on upgrading to that, so I've not made the effort to learn more about it to be honest.

But an idea I had was using a small pair of bookshelfs for the Atmos channels. You could have one over the front left and right speakers sort of like how some people put their front bookshelfs on top of a pair of subwoofers when running stereo subs. Then you could just aim them along with finding the best position in the ceiling for the reflective panels to get the best performance.

If I did upgrade, I would probably go that route. I could go with having them directly mounted in the ceiling as all I would have to do would be to pull a couple of tiles from my drop ceiling and them make some mounts between the joists. I wouldn't want to run the extra cabling to that, so just another run of cable to my fronts would be a lot easier.

 

[Towen7]

Here is an excellent FAQ document that may help...

http://www.outlawaudio.com/outlaw/docs/ ... Layout.pdf


How can I get overhead sound if I don’t mount speakers in my ceiling?
Use Dolby Atmos enabled speakers. Employing a combination of unique physical speaker design and special signal processing, Dolby Atmos enabled speakers allow you to experience overhead sounds from speakers that are placed at the same level as traditional speakers. The new speakers fire upward and reflect sound off the ceiling to create a faithful reproduction of audio coming from above.
You can buy speakers that combine traditional speakers with the upward-firing Dolby Atmos enabled drivers in one cabinet. Or, if you don’t want to replace your current speakers, you can purchase add-on speaker modules equipped with Dolby Atmos enabled technology that you can place on top of or near your existing speakers.

Will Dolby Atmos enabled speakers work in my room?
Dolby Atmos enabled speakers can produce an incredibly immersive Dolby Atmos experience in many kinds of rooms. You’ll get the best sound if your ceiling is flat (not vaulted or angled) and made of an acoustically reflective material, such as drywall, plaster, concrete, or wood. Dolby designed the technology for rooms with ceiling heights of 8 to 9 feet (2.4 to 2.7 meters), but testing has shown that you can still hear incredible overhead sound in rooms with ceilings as high as 14 feet (4.3 meters), though the effect may become more diffuse in rooms with higher ceilings.

What are the different types of Dolby Atmos enabled speakers?
There are two types of Dolby Atmos enabled speakers: integrated speakers and add-on speaker modules.
Integrated speakers Integrated speakers include a Dolby Atmos enabled speaker and a traditional front-firing speaker in the same speaker cabinet. The Dolby Atmos enabled speaker is housed in a separate section of the speaker cabinet and has its own set of binding post inputs. Integrated speakers are great if you’re considering buying new main or surround speakers.
Add-on modules Manufacturers are also producing Dolby Atmos enabled speakers in separate cabinets. These are ideal if you already have main speakers that you like. By adding separate Dolby Atmos enabled add-on modules, you can get Dolby Atmos sound while keeping your existing equipment. You can put the add-on modules on top of your existing speakers or nearby on another surface.

 

[elfstone]

The more reflective the ceiling surface the better. I don't know however if those speakers allow you to adjust the angle of the "height" speakers on top.

I don't know a lot about Atmos, so I couldn't tell you if the drivers in a pair of built in Atmos speakers would be adjustable or not. I don't really plan on upgrading to that, so I've not made the effort to learn more about it to be honest.

But an idea I had was using a small pair of bookshelfs for the Atmos channels. You could have one over the front left and right speakers sort of like how some people put their front bookshelfs on top of a pair of subwoofers when running stereo subs. Then you could just aim them along with finding the best position in the ceiling for the reflective panels to get the best performance.

If I did upgrade, I would probably go that route. I could go with having them directly mounted in the ceiling as all I would have to do would be to pull a couple of tiles from my drop ceiling and them make some mounts between the joists. I wouldn't want to run the extra cabling to that, so just another run of cable to my fronts would be a lot easier.

You could probably try using a pair of bookshelves and see how they work for you. I went with the upfiring Klipsch and they work great. You could also go with in-ceiling speakers. I was going to go that route, but after the installer came out to see the work area, he said there was no way anyone could get up there to run the wire. The only alternative was to do a lot of drilling, drywall tearing up and patching. No thanks.

Experiment (especially if you have some extra bookshelves about). You will need a receiver that does Atmos though.

 

[Yesfan70]

...............You will need a receiver that does Atmos though.

That's the catch 22 for me.


Funny this thread popped back up. At the time of my last post, I didn't know you can buy "atmos" speakers that sit on top of your mains if you didn't want to get the tower with built in atmos speakers. I think that option would be the best bet as you could keep your current speakers, be able to aim the Atmos speakers, etc. To me, built in Atmos speakers seem too much like the built in subs of some expensive power towers.


I don't plan on upgrading to Atmos, but if the decoder is on my next receiver, I do have a spare pair of matching bookshelfs I can use. I bought them as parts in case the drivers ever fail on the ones I'm running.