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One more enlightened soul! Bose Sucks

Flint

Flint

Prodigal Son
Superstar
"Putting them on for the first time made me realize something — I hadn’t been listening to music through great-sounding headphones in a long while. I have my personal Bose QC25 headphones as a daily driver, and coming from them the MDR-1000X feels like a warm bath."

http://thenextweb.com/opinion/2016/12/02/sony-mdr-1000x-review/

A reviewer discovered that Bose headphones don't really sound all that good. He defends his prior very positive reviews of the Bose QC25 with a short, "They’re not bad headphones.." then adds, "...but they pale in comparison to the MDR-1000X."

I love seeing that.
 
The only thing I will give Bose is that they make a decent sounding (if overpriced) Bluetooth speaker.
 
The main issue with Bose is value for the dollar. They make several decent sounding things, but the cost 4x what similar performance from anyone else offers.
 
I have heard them, as well, at those very carefully crafted demos in Airports all over America. And, yes, they sound bigger than their physical size would suggest. That said, so do Sony's, JBL's, Klipsch's, Sonus's, and even some generic models I saw at Fry's. For the price of the Bose SoundLink Mini I can get a dozen better BT speakers. Heck, as similar prices to the Bose, you could get the Marshall Bluetooth speakers which are shockingly loud for their price and size.

That's kinda the point. Bose stuff isn't pure crap out of the box. It is just way overpriced for performance you get.

Also, I pushed the smaller Bose Soundlink Color ($119 to $129 on Amazon) pretty hard and while it sounded pretty pleasant at low levels, it couldn't come close to the SPL's and bass output as my JBL Charge which I purchased for les than $90 a few years ago. The newer JBL is even louder and plays deeper. And I've heard the sexier Sony models and they are pretty darn amazing.

So, to my point, it is a value discussion and always has been.

The Quiet Comfort headphones would be priced right (in my opinion) at about 60% of their current selling price and their speakers at about 50% of the selling price. If they weren't so damned expensive, they'd be reasonable options for certain users.
 
Ooops, SoundLink is what I meant. We have one. Sounds impressive. Feels even more so. Did I overpay by $100? Sure. But I've done far worse with far more so I'm good with it.
 
I think it is absolutely amazing how good some of these little speakers actually sound. I'm not talking about any particular manufacturer, just the general state of the technology.
 
Yeah... they combined amazing advancements good small driver technologies with DSP which can boost the bass and treble at low output levels to make them sound "loud" then reduce the boost at higher levels to allow for higher SPLs with less distortion or limits. If you recall in the early 00s there were lots of cutting edge DSPs launched and announced with promised to boost the perceived bass of small speakers without killing the peak SPLs. That stuff is run of the mill boring tech now and only needs careful tuning by a good engineer and perception expert.
 
The big differences tend to be the amount spent on the drivers, the ergonomic designs, and target applications (small, big, long battery life, waterproof, etc.). Given that some of those little 2" drivers can cost anywhere from $1 each to as much as $50 each wholesale, you can see why one model costs $50 while another costs $300 with the same size drivers.
 
Yeah ... I have a little Amazon branded BT speaker that sounds amazing for its price and size. I carry it in my bag for when I do presentations off site. The other day just for fun I was playing Christmas music through it in our technican crew room which is a HUUUUUUGE space. While it certainly could "fill" the space several people remaked at how great is sounded within 30' or so.

On the other end of the spectrum my Sonos Play1 speakers sound sooo much bigger than they really are.
 
I bought little sub-sat systems to stick in the bedrooms and kitchen when I moved into this house, but honestly I'm not sure I would bother if I were doing it all over.
 
Flint said:
Yeah... they combined amazing advancements good small driver technologies with DSP which can boost the bass and treble at low output levels to make them sound "loud" then reduce the boost at higher levels to allow for higher SPLs with less distortion or limits. If you recall in the early 00s there were lots of cutting edge DSPs launched and announced with promised to boost the perceived bass of small speakers without killing the peak SPLs.
Click to expand...
Sounds not unlike the purely analog "Loudness" circuits from the mid-70's...
 
Botch said:
Sounds not unlike the purely analog "Loudness" circuits from the mid-70's...
Click to expand...

The concept of loudness is exactly the same, but those old circuits were either 100% on or 100% off (with the only exception I know of being a few analog Yamaha preamps). With these new speakers they are closed systems, so they can tune the DSP to have the right amount of EQ for every output level and change the amount of EQ in real time following the signal. No need to turn on or off the EQ circuit, it is constantly variable.
 
Flint said:
...those old circuits were either 100% on or 100% off (with the only exception I know of being a few analog Yamaha preamps).
Click to expand...
Was on my Yammie CA-810 Integrated Amp, one of the features that had me buy it (along with the fantastic S/N Ratio and the more sensible (to me) "tape out" circuits); I still have it.
 
My Yamaha RX-485 stereo receiver has the variable loudness control as well. I have seen it on a Denon stereo receiver too. It's not that uncommon I guess.
 
Eric, I have to ask: have you ever used it? I haven't, if I wanted it loud in college and it was after hours, or Finals week, I clamped on the headphones; now if I want it loud I play it loud. Never actually used the damn Loudness control.
 
Botch said:
Eric, I have to ask: have you ever used it? I haven't, if I wanted it loud in college and it was after hours, or Finals week, I clamped on the headphones; now if I want it loud I play it loud. Never actually used the damn Loudness control.
Click to expand...
Not too often but I have used it. Sometimes when I can only listen to my tunes softly such as at night when I still had a housemate, I could enjoy the tunes very quietly without losing the (perceived) bass response. Many years ago my folks had a Sanyo boombox (we called them ghetto blasters back then) that had auto loudness. It basically functioned like the variable loudness control but was just the actual volume control.
The variable loudness control on my Yammy worked well for headphone use as well.
 
Hmmm, never tried it through phones; something to do over xmas break!
 
The whole point of that variable loudness control is to always use it no matter what - BUT - it comes it caveats if you want it to work as designed.

With the Yamaha version, first you have to turn the loudness control all the way to up, like it is set to max (which is the opposite of all the way up electrically) then tune your system at the highest SPL you think you'll ever desire. Once perfectly tuned for ideal tonality (bass and treble exactly how you like them), then going forward you only use the variable loudness control as the volume control. That way, as you turn the volume down with the loudness control, you are in fact turning down the midrange slightly faster than the bass and treble. The circuit is designed to follow the "Equal Loudness Curve" so that the resulting sound will be perceived to have the same levels of bass and treble as when the volume was very high and tuned perfectly.

Basically, the loudness control becomes the only volume control you ever touch once setup properly.

That's how I used it when I had a Yamaha preamp back in the 1980s and worked perfectly. The only problem was my wife didn't get it and she would adjust the main volume control. So, I put a little piece of tape on the preamp face to know where to reset the main volume control to every time I started listening to music. It worked for me.

Now for the problem with this Headphone idea. If you tune the system while using your speakers, the loudness control is now tuned to the speakers, not the headphones. If you are VERY lucky, the headphone SPL will be very similar to the speakers SPL when the volume control is at the same point. Then the loudness control will work. Otherwise it is not going to be an ideal setup and the bass and treble will be either too loud or too quiet.

Personally, I gave up on using loudness controls years ago and just generally listen at higher levels where I can perceive the bass and treble clearly.
 
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