Help Me Pick Out New Bookshelves :)

[team_tsp]

Background:
Hey everyone, I was a long time lurker of the S&V forums and have always enjoyed your discussions. I currently have a dedicated music room, and my 2.1 system consists of a pair of Paradigm Studio 20 v3 and an SVS PB12-NSD subwoofer. To power the Paradigms and handle bass management, I have a cheap Denon AVR. I’m thinking of moving the Paradigms and Denon to another room for general music/movies/tv purposes, and leaving the SVS in my music room for now.

(I’ll create a separate thread about electronics, and will add link here when created.)

What I like about my current system:
The Paradigms sound transparent, articulate, and effortless. I truly feel like I’m listening directly to the recording when I listen to music on these speakers. The SVS is great and I’ll be leaving it as the .1 (bass) of the new music system.

What I don’t like about my current system, or rather what I’m looking for in new speakers:
I think I want speakers where the treble and midrange are a tiny bit more velvety. This weird analogy comes to my mind and I have no idea if it makes sense to others: when I listen to the Paradigms, it’s kind of like watching water get poured smoothly; however, I’m looking for speakers that will make me feel like I'm watching milk get poured smoothly. A few years ago I auditioned a pair of PSB Image B25 and the tweeter sounded like this, and I absolutely loved it. For such a cheap speaker I was amazed by the tweeter, but the low price point did reveal other weaknesses in the speaker overall. Of course, I don't want to stray too far and sacrifice the other strengths of the Paradigm tweeters.

Of more importance, I mentioned above I feel like the Paradigms are a window into the recording. However, I would like speakers that make it sound like the musician is playing live in the room with you, is this possible with my budget (stated next)? I want these to be the last speakers I buy

Budget:
I’m allocating a bit more than $2,000 for these new bookshelves. I’d prefer to stay close to $2k, but if the perfect speaker is a bit more, then ok. It’s very unlikely I’ll be willing to spend more than $3k.

Here are the speakers I plan on auditioning, please let me know if there are any thoughts or insights on my questions:
Usher Be-718 Diamond DMD:
http://www.usheraudiousa.com/products/loudspeakers/dancer-series/Be-718-DMD

PSB Synchrony One B:
http://www.psbspeakers.com/products/synchrony/Synchrony-One-B

Dynaudio?
I haven’t called the local dealer yet, so not sure what they have available for audition that’s in my price range. Any suggestions?

Seas Odin?
What is everyone’s’ thoughts on this kit? I know it’s well regarded, and even though there is a fair amount of information on various forums, I still feel like it’s not enough to read LOL. The idea of purchasing a speaker without auditioning it first is kind of scary. Also, not sure if Madisound still offers pre-built cabinets, I know Zalytron does but they don’t list their prices (I guess I would have to call).
http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/mt ... -kit-pair/

SVS Ultra Bookshelf?
Has anyone auditioned these, as this is another example of not being able to audition before purchasing? Do we feel these are promising?
https://www.svsound.com/speakers/ultra- ... -bookshelf

Proac Tablette and/or D Two?
One of the local dealers has these available for audition, I haven’t heard much about them but I might audition them if I have time. Thoughts on these?

Any other bookshelves that you would highly recommend in my price range?


I know the above is a lot of questions LOL, I appreciate everyone's expertise! :music-listening:

 

[scubabob]

I'll toss in the B&W N805. I think they are around $2k. I think you'll do well with the Ushers. Both the N805 and Ushers will give you good tweeters.

 

[PaulyT]

Damn it's been so long since we've talked about audio gear here that my first thought on reading your post title was that it was about furniture shelves for actual books rather than speakers...

Welcome to the forum! Glad you made it here. I had studio 20 v3 for a quite a while, loved them. They're now in another forum member's house. I don't have much to add to your list above, which looks good - I've always wanted to hear those Ushers, I thought about them at one point as well. Zing seems to be pretty happy with his Swanns, I've heard those at his place and was quite impressed. Are they still making those, Zing? I can't find them on the 'net, maybe I'm not remembering the name right...?

It may also be beneficial to do some acoustic treatments to help smooth things out some... or maybe you already have? May help you get the most bang for the buck as you upgrade the speakers.

 

[Zing]

Zing seems to be pretty happy with his Swanns, I've heard those at his place and was quite impressed. Are they still making those, Zing?

You're right, I am quite happy with them. Thoughts of upgrading have never been anything more than fleeting.

They are indeed still making them. I believe The Audio Insider is the only place you can buy them. And Jon Lane is an absolute joy to deal with.

As for the OP, it's difficult to extrapolate the water/milk analogy and make any suggestions. The only thing that comes to mind is that the Paradigms have a metal dome tweeter (water) and perhaps he may prefer a soft dome (milk). That said, since this type of decision is so personal and subjective, nothing will do as much good as auditioning as many speakers as possible, preferably in the room they'll be used.

Welcome aboard, team_tsp. It's good to have you here.

bscene-drinkingcheers: <--- those mugs are filled with milk, by the way.

 

[Flint]

My favorites are the Dynaudio Contour and Seas Odin. Not a big fan of most of the others you list.

If you are using a subwoofer, don't get caught up in power handling, bass extension, or driver size. Those characteristics are aimed primarily at driving bass performance, which you won't need. Set the crossover somewhere between 60Hz and 80Hz and let the sub do the muscle work. You need delicacy, character, style, and realism from the midrange and treble.

 

[Yesfan70]

Of the list, I would go with Dynaudio. I know I like them as I've heard them, but I can't comment on the others since I haven't had the chance to demo. The Odins were high up on my list too at one time for a 2 channel rig, but I just don't have the room.


I've heard the Paradigms and love the Studio line. They are not an average speaker and are probably one brand I could stay with and not want to upgrade. Because of this, I would spend a lot of time demoing as many different brands as you can.

 

[TKoP]

Although I'd love for you to go with the Odin's, I think when you tack on the cost of the cabinets, you're probably over your budget -- and I didn't see that you could buy the cabinets there either. Unless you're thinking about doing it yourself, I'd consider your other choices.

Another general vote for Dynaudio. I've heard products from most all others on your list -- just as a general rule, I think the Dynaudios were the most... something... transparent?

 

[lulimet]

The Dynaudio Contour S1.4 retail for $3.5k. That's way over your budget.
The new Focus 160 retail for $1900. That's within your budget. A lot of people seem to like the new Focus line.

 

[AndySTL]

+1 on the Dynaudio recommendation. I also owned Paradigm Studio 20 v.3 in the past and now have Dyns. It was a welcome change for me.

Are you willing to buy used speakers?

 

[Bob R]

Background:

Usher Be-718 Diamond DMD:
http://www.usheraudiousa.com/products/loudspeakers/dancer-series/Be-718-DMD

:

Welcome to the Forum.

Recently, I auditioned a pair of Studio 60's, (I thought they sounded just like my Studio 20's).

While I was there, I listened to the Usher Be-718's.

I was astounded by the difference. A very big soundstage for two book shelves. Very nice high end and some oomf in the middle.

(note the technical term, Oomf) :handgestures-thumbup:

MSRP was $3K for the pair.

 

[yromj]

Welcome to the fray!! I'll admit that my first thought was very similar to Pauly's: Is he talking about shelving our speakers?

Of the ones you listed, I'm only familiar w/ are the 'Digms and the Dynaudios. The Dynaudio Focal line is very nice and the Contour line is astounding, though they are pricey.

John

 

[Batman]

What area are you in? And who is your local Dynaudio dealer? I might be able to arrange an extended demo for you with some Focus 160s and/or Contour S 1.4s, depending on territorial constraints...

 

[team_tsp]

Thanks for welcoming me to the forum everyone bscene-drinkingcheers:

I should have been a little more clear - I've had the Paradigms and SVS for about 6 years and have been pretty pleased with the setup. I'm not wanting to get new speakers because I'm unhappy with the Paradigms, but rather I'm thinking moving them to enjoy in my living room (speakers in flat-panel TVs are awful). This is just brainstorming, and I'm not in any rush

I did a bit of auditioning and also called around, and am realizing this is going to be a much more interesting journey than I thought:

PSB Synchrony One:
There are two PSB dealers in my area, but neither carry the bookshelf model so I listened to the towers. There are some definite strengths, but also weaknesses. Overall it was a good speaker, but not worth the high price (especially of the towers), which is disappointing (especially for PSB).

On a side note - Monitor Audio Silver:
At the same dealer where I listened to the PSBs, I briefly listened to some Monitor Audio Silver RX6 towers. These had really rolled off highs (bad), and other weaknesses expected from the price point, but other than that they were actually pretty fun to listen to.

B&W 805D:
I randomly swung by a chain-store dealer to see what they carried. I listened to a pair of these, but they are not a right fit for me. (And way out of my budget.)

Usher Audio:
Per their website I called their U.S. distributor (as they don't list dealers). A rude guy answered the phone and told me that there are no dealers in my region, or even timezone for that matter. Aside from his rude tone, this is a shame because I had high hopes of auditioning (and liking) Usher speakers.

Dynaudio:
Apparently there is only one Dynaudio dealer in my area. This guy sounded like a snake-oil salesman, and emphasized how important it is to match the 'sonic character' of certain electronics with Dynaudios. Aside from that, they only do in-home auditions, where they bring items to your home to have a listen. This sounds like it could be a good experience, or a really bad one. They carry the Focus 160 as well as Contour S 1.4.
--

As mentioned above, I'm in no rush and will keep auditioning and gathering information. I would rather buy new, but may consider buying used if I feel confident in the seller.

Does anyone have experience with the Dynaudio Focus 160 (I know lulimet mentioned them)?
Likewise, are the Contour S1.4 a huge upgrade over those?
(I just want get more understanding on Dynaudio's to decide if I want the hassle of snake-oil-salesman coming into my home LOL.)

And how does the Seas Odin compare to either of the Dynaudios? How would you all describe the sound of the Odins?


Can any of these speakers make the music sound live?


Thanks!!

 

[Razz]

Great response from members here.

I too owned Paradigm Studio.. but I owned the Studio 80v.2.

I loved them for years.. then after numerous auditions, I finally made a jump to the Dyns myself and absolutely loved the upgrade to the Focal line.... Loved it so much that I kept auditioning and within 2 years I upgraded to the Contour line.

I've have been very happy about my upgrades and would encourage you to upgrade as well... but I really hope you can do some "home auditions" before you make the upgrade! Speakers sound totally different in your home compared to your dealers audition room.

Your idea of "Water" and "Milk" can be totally different to everyone else.


My advise is to take your time... audition as much as you can... and go with what you love! This is a big buy!!!!
But try as much as possible to audition them in your home before purchase.

I was fortunate to audition the B&W 805 against my Dynaudio surround speakers "Contour SR" and preferred my Contour SR's over them... And the Contour 1.4 are a step up from the SR. But then again... that's just my opinion.
(I did have my sub active during my audition)

Welcome to the frey... and if you are free June 12-16 and near by... consider stopping by Batman's pad for lots of listening!

 

[Rope]

^^^
THIS!
I'll suggest Adam Audio passive monitors for audition.

Rope

 

[Deleted member 133]

Since nobody has asked yet, I will: why so set on "bookshelf" speakers for the new pair?

If it's space considerations then fine, go for it. End of discussion. Ignore what follows.

But I'd think that for $2k (and maybe a tad more) that you might want to at least consider something "bigger."

That sub of yours will fill out the bottom end of whatever you get (in a 2.1 music set-up).

Yeah I know that some will jump all over that suggestion - and I respect them for it - but I've never been able to really really like bookshelves over "real" speakers.

Jeff

ps. I'm the one who bought PaulyT's Studio 20's and think they sound great and are perfect for my space-limited family room HT. But would I want them (in concert with a good sub) in a dedicated 2.1 music set-up - where I could have something more substantial instead? Nope.

 

[Towen7]

If I were shopping for new speakers I'd have Atlantic Technology AT-2 (bookshelf) or AT-1 (towers) on my list.

 

[jamhead]

Thanks for welcoming me to the forum everyone bscene-drinkingcheers:

I should have been a little more clear - I've had the Paradigms and SVS for about 6 years and have been pretty pleased with the setup. I'm not wanting to get new speakers because I'm unhappy with the Paradigms, but rather I'm thinking moving them to enjoy in my living room (speakers in flat-panel TVs are awful). This is just brainstorming, and I'm not in any rush

I did a bit of auditioning and also called around, and am realizing this is going to be a much more interesting journey than I thought:

PSB Synchrony One:
There are two PSB dealers in my area, but neither carry the bookshelf model so I listened to the towers. There are some definite strengths, but also weaknesses. Overall it was a good speaker, but not worth the high price (especially of the towers), which is disappointing (especially for PSB).

On a side note - Monitor Audio Silver:
At the same dealer where I listened to the PSBs, I briefly listened to some Monitor Audio Silver RX6 towers. These had really rolled off highs (bad), and other weaknesses expected from the price point, but other than that they were actually pretty fun to listen to.

B&W 805D:
I randomly swung by a chain-store dealer to see what they carried. I listened to a pair of these, but they are not a right fit for me. (And way out of my budget.)

Usher Audio:
Per their website I called their U.S. distributor (as they don't list dealers). A rude guy answered the phone and told me that there are no dealers in my region, or even timezone for that matter. Aside from his rude tone, this is a shame because I had high hopes of auditioning (and liking) Usher speakers.

Dynaudio:
Apparently there is only one Dynaudio dealer in my area. This guy sounded like a snake-oil salesman, and emphasized how important it is to match the 'sonic character' of certain electronics with Dynaudios. Aside from that, they only do in-home auditions, where they bring items to your home to have a listen. This sounds like it could be a good experience, or a really bad one. They carry the Focus 160 as well as Contour S 1.4.
--

As mentioned above, I'm in no rush and will keep auditioning and gathering information. I would rather buy new, but may consider buying used if I feel confident in the seller.

Does anyone have experience with the Dynaudio Focus 160 (I know lulimet mentioned them)?
Likewise, are the Contour S1.4 a huge upgrade over those?
(I just want get more understanding on Dynaudio's to decide if I want the hassle of snake-oil-salesman coming into my home LOL.)

And how does the Seas Odin compare to either of the Dynaudios? How would you all describe the sound of the Odins?


Can any of these speakers make the music sound live?


Thanks!!

My opinion is "yes". They are worth a listen. I search for new speakers for over a year and Dyns. hit that "spot" with me. I own one s1.4 for a center channel and that speaker is very good at what it does.

AVS forums has a Dynaudio Owners thread that's full of ignorant snake oil speaker owners who place their personal worth on the speakers they own. So, I wouldn't recommend going there for advice or to learn about the speakers, as most of the people there haven't a clue. However, due to their nature, they do sell a lot of speakers (constantly upgrading) so you may be able to get a slightly used pair for a good price.

Just tell the sales rep as he enters your home to set up the speakers and simply not talk. (I actually told a sales rep this and he sat in the corner and let me listen).

OK, so maybe I'm rude. I simply don't care.

Good luck! You may want to check out Revel's, though their treble can be a little hot for me.

 

[Deleted member 133]

If I were shopping for new speakers I'd have Atlantic Technology AT-2 (bookshelf) or AT-1 (towers) on my list.

Now that's what I'm talking about!

Thinking outside the (little) box!

Jeff

 

[Towen7]

Jeff -

Didn't you get to hear the AT-1 at show a year or three ago?