PSB Synchrony One B as an upgade to Paradigm Studio 20?

[BrianZ]

Have been using Paradigm Studio 20 v3 as my mains for almost 10 years now, I have loved them but am now looking for something different, mostly just because. Here are the things that sometimes bother me about them: (1) a little too bright & harsh, most notably at higher volumes. (2) a little chesty in the low mids / upper bass, which can make vocals sound a bit bloated & unclear at times, especially with movies. I have sub so clear & natural mids are much more important to me than deep bass.

After doing a bunch of reading lately, a few models are on my radar in my budget (all used):
- PSB Synchrony One B
- Dynaudio Focus 160 (if I can find a killer used deal)
- possibly Paradigm Studio 20 v4 or v5, and even Paradigm Signature if I can find a killer used deal

The most likely to be in my budget, and as of right now my top choice, are the PSB Synchrony One B's, but they seem hard to find. They are also the prettiest imo (cherry version), which is fairly important for us. All that said, I have my eye one pair of mint ones that I'm prepared jump on.

Anyway, can't really find many comparison discussions between the PSB's, or any of the other models, and my 20 v3's. Can anyone provide any experience that might help? I know hearing in person is the only definitive way to go, but since used, older models seem to be the only way to find promising upgrades in my budget then I can't hear them first.

 

[Batman]

I did see a set of used Focus 160s on eBay, black. Current bid is at $560 plus shipping. The list price on those were ~$2900 so they're worth keeping an eye on.

 

[Flint]

First off, both of the aspects you describe as being problematic with your current speakers, harsh treble at higher levels and chesty bass at times, are both very common artifacts of room acoustics impacting your sound. With the treble, a highly reflective room will get brighter and brighter and brighter sounding as the SPL is gets high and starts exciting all the room reflections at audible levels. The same applies to the bass - a chesty, boomy, muddy bass is very often solely caused by the room modes resonanting enough to make the bass bloated and muddy, especially if you have very good speakers (which you do).

These issues can also be caused by aggressive use of EQ, especially the automatic EQ tools built into receivers and pre-pros. Sometimes they can boost a range to much that the amp and speakers get both get stressed at lower overall levels than they would without EQ applied.

Before you replace your speakers to address those problems, you might want to ensure room acoustics are the cause. Otherwise your new speakers will exhibit the exact same characteristics at the exact same volume levels. Same goes for looking into the use of EQ.


Secondly, of the list of speakers you list, the Dynaudio Focus 160 is the best, period. Don't waste time on the others. Of course, that's just my opinion, but I will stand behind it.


If you just want to buy new speakers, go for it, things will definitely sound different with new speakers because no two speaker brands sound the same.

 

[Barney]

If it was me.....move up to a tower. Focus 260's.
I love my Studio 20 v2's. But if I move up it wouldn't be another bookshelf....it would be a step up.
I'm sure you know those Dynaudio's are 4ohm speakers and you said you listen at higher levels.......have a good amp to drive those Dynaudio's.

 

[BrianZ]

i am indeed watching that Focus 160 listing on ebay, but i doubt it will go for less than $1500-1700, which would likely be out of reach for me even if i get a decent price for my Studio 20's.

Flint, you're room treatment theory has promise to say the least, as this room is completely untreated. the wall across from the speakers is essentially bare except for a console piano and a set of five Ikea CD racks. there is a couch in between though, and the oak floors are mostly covered with a huge rug. so not great, but maybe not as bad as it could be. in addition, i remember when i was calibrating my sub i got some pretty weird readings from my Radio Shack meter, like some unexpected dips & spikes once you get below 60 Hz or so. the room is mostly square, but it is open to two other rooms, one on either side. but again, a lot of bare walls and hard furniture. anyway, you all don't give a shit about our decor, bottom line is that i take your warning to heart. since sound treatments or even soft wall ornaments are not in the cards for the foreseeable future, i suppose i'd do well to get something in the house to try first before committing to anything. there are two Dynaudio dealers close by - perhaps they'd allow some sort of no risk trial or something. Flint's strong opinion on this model is hard to ignore.

So no love for the "other" Canadian maker then, eh? Didn't the Synchrony bookshelf also go for well over $2k a pair? What if I told you I might have a line on a mint set for less than $1k?

 

[Flint]

Canadian? What about PMC.

 

[BrianZ]

Canadian? What about PMC.

uh oh. don't know them. i've been on a headphone kick for the last year so i'm a bit behind. guess i have some reading to do. anyone else new making waves in the mid range?

 

[Deleted member 133]

Canadian? What about PMC.

PMC is British, not Canadian. But I'm sure you knew that.

Energy, Mirage, and Totem would be three other Canadian brands to consider.

Of the three, Energy most embodies the "Canadian" speaker sound and will be very similar sounding to Paradigm and PSB. Mirage: less so. Totem: much less so.

Just answering BrianZ's question - not suggesting that "Canadian" is necessarily the way to go in his case - although this post earns me three more credits towards my Patriotism Badge of Honour.

Jeff

 

[BrianZ]

If it was me.....move up to a tower. Focus 260's.
I love my Studio 20 v2's. But if I move up it wouldn't be another bookshelf....it would be a step up.
I'm sure you know those Dynaudio's are 4ohm speakers and you said you listen at higher levels.......have a good amp to drive those Dynaudio's.

no, i just can't do it. my wife is not into it and frankly neither am i. the size of the sound i get from my Studio 20's, plus my memory of all the other mid range bookshelf models i've tried have convinced me there's no need to go bigger, unless perhaps you have a huge room (which i don't) or don't use a sub (which i do).

 

[Flint]

Canadian? What about PMC.

PMC is British, not Canadian. But I'm sure you knew that.

Energy, Mirage, and Totem would be three other Canadian brands to consider.

Of the three, Energy most embodies the "Canadian" speaker sound and will be very similar sounding to Paradigm and PSB. Mirage: less so. Totem: much less so.

Just answering BrianZ's question - not suggesting that "Canadian" is necessarily the way to go in his case - although this post earns me three more credits towards my Patriotism Badge of Honour.

Jeff

Huh! I was totally wrong on that.

Well, they aren't American and speak English, so whatever. :teasing-tease:


I like Mirage.

 

[Barney]

Brian, thats why I'm still loving my 20 v2's. My room is small & I use a sub also........ I think the only way I would upgrade would be because of damage to my 20's. Even then I would look for bookshelfs or move my NHT towers into my room. Love NHT also.

 

[Botch]

I think the only way I would upgrade would be because of damage to my 20's. Even then I would look for bookshelfs or move my NHT towers into my room. Love NHT also.

In my search for new speakers about 5 years ago, NHT came very near the top of my list, but Barney this is the first time, that I can recall, anyone on AA mentioning them before.

 

[Barney]

I've owned NHT forever. In my living room are my NHT 1.4 towers (my wife loves these).
In my room are a pair of Super One's for my rears & my center is a VS 1.4 . The drivers used for mine are made in Denmark. ...not sure what is used now.
Its my understanding that NHT made the 1st subwoofer.
I love NHT's. You have a dealer in your area I think. They are coming out with a new line for 2016. NHT is used in alot of studios.

 

[mcad64]

Canadian? What about PMC.

PMC is British, not Canadian. But I'm sure you knew that.

Energy, Mirage, and Totem would be three other Canadian brands to consider.

Of the three, Energy most embodies the "Canadian" speaker sound and will be very similar sounding to Paradigm and PSB. Mirage: less so. Totem: much less so.

Just answering BrianZ's question - not suggesting that "Canadian" is necessarily the way to go in his case - although this post earns me three more credits towards my Patriotism Badge of Honour.

Jeff

Do I get my badge for naming Axiom as a Canadian speaker company??!! CEO, Ian Colquhoun worked with Floyd Toole at the NRC.

But to get back on point.
BrianZ, have you listened to any of the speakers you listed? Like my Mom used to say "Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one" Let your ears be your guide. I have PSB Platinum M2's (top line series before the Synchrony came out) and I love them. But that is just my opinion!!

 

[Flint]

NHT sells direct now. They do support some showrooms, but they dont keep inventory.

M&K was one of the earliest brands to promote the use of subwoofers and they were relatively successful in the professional recording studio market, so I think you are confusing them with NHT.

NHT tried making powered studio monitors, but they did not find much success.

 

[BrianZ]

Canadian? What about PMC.

PMC is British, not Canadian. But I'm sure you knew that.

Energy, Mirage, and Totem would be three other Canadian brands to consider.

Of the three, Energy most embodies the "Canadian" speaker sound and will be very similar sounding to Paradigm and PSB. Mirage: less so. Totem: much less so.

Just answering BrianZ's question - not suggesting that "Canadian" is necessarily the way to go in his case - although this post earns me three more credits towards my Patriotism Badge of Honour.

Jeff

Do I get my badge for naming Axiom as a Canadian speaker company??!! CEO, Ian Colquhoun worked with Floyd Toole at the NRC.

But to get back on point.
BrianZ, have you listened to any of the speakers you listed? Like my Mom used to say "Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one" Let your ears be your guide. I have PSB Platinum M2's (top line series before the Synchrony came out) and I love them. But that is just my opinion!!

No, I haven't. There look to be two higher end showrooms in my area so I'm planning to take a couple holiday hi-fi days soon, although IME this has limited value due to room differences, that is once you're in the realm of hair splitting like this. but i really am dying to hear the Focus 160's.

And of course the other tack is to buy used and do some real a/b'ing in my own space with minimal financial risk, even though buying & selling for larger gear is such a huge hassle (at least i'm not looking at floorstanders, right?). this really appeals to me, and the best course to assess how much of my issues are room related.

 

[Rope]

PMC TB2 +

Rope

 

[BrianZ]

Ok so despite everyone's advice I just sent payment on the used set of PSB Synchrony One B's. The price was too good to pass up and since they're discontinued I just can't imagine any other way I'd get to try them, especially in my own space. Fairly low risk as I imagine it would be pretty easy to get what I paid for them if I decide to sell.

I bet you guys love when jerks ignore your advice and just do what they really want anyway. [sheepish shrug]

 

[PaulyT]

I do that all the time, just check the headphone section when I talk about amps!

 

[Rope]

Glad we could help with your decision.

Rope